Edit: 5 March 2016 - For those who have got up in arms about this post, this is NOT a letter of demand! These are observations and discussions that have been had with many other stall holders of all kinds. We do not expect markets for free but would like to point out that we are not made of money. I have been told by someone that if they were a market organiser and saw this post, they would tell me to get stuffed and not come back. I, like you, are entitled to my opinion but telling someone to get stuffed is just rude and shows a disregard for stall holders who pay you good money for organisers to do the right thing by them. Any good market organiser would like to see their market flourish with return stall holders and return customers but there are many out there who are not aware of how they organise their market(s) has a negative impact, not a positive. Rather than seeing this as a destructive letter of demand, it should be seen as observations and discussions that organisers may not be aware of or aspects that need to be rethought.
As a stall holder, I can truly see all the effort that you have gone to in getting the market ready for trade. I know councils/venues can be demanding and you can never guarantee from market to market how many people will attend, if Mother Nature decides the plants need a heavy dose of water and lastly, advertising is not cheap and not to forget the deep sting of insurance.
BUT, many of us who have stalls are wondering how to justify some the stall fees that are being demanded. Prices are anywhere from $40 per stall and then head north on a very steep curve with some being $400 for a small one off charity market and some of those demanding a percentage of your takings on top of the fee. One event spotted recently was charging $1000+ per day for a 3 day event for a space in the middle of a paddock and your stall had to be operating from 11am to 11.30pm. Long damn day for no guarantee of any kind of sales that will come close to covering the stall fee.
One market I have attended advised told stall holders that if you are not making the stall fee back and with plenty of profit, you must have an inferior product and are not welcome back. Really? WTF? I must say, nice attitude to have about the people who are paying YOU to do the right thing and promote the market, not just promote your own produce and bugger the rest! Also the swipe about sitting down at your stall was unfair too. If I want or need to sit down at my stall, I shall!
Markets for some are their ONLY source of income or a significant proportion to a SUPPORTING income. Just this weekend the Father of a friend told me that people who sell at markets make a LOT of money. REALLY?? Did I set him straight very quickly! Some of us are barely walking away with $10 after paying stall fees and we haven't even factored in cost of the product to make stall fee, travel etc...
Please find below some points that my fellow stallholders and I have discussed many times over that may be of useful service when you are organising your next event:
1. Cost per stall vs amount of stock to cover stall fee then cover making of stock
Whilst this may or may not be obvious, not everyone who is a stall holder sells cheap items and on the flip side, not everyone sells high price items. Also not everyone sells produce that are required on a weekly basis. How much we have to sell to cover stall fee is one part of the equation, we then need to sell x amount on top of that just to cover the cost of the materials that went into paying for the stall fee. It usually works out around double. Eg. a $60 stall fee needs to have $120 in sales to break even and then stall holders need to pay for stalls in advance, so make it $180 before you even think of packing up and going home dreaming of your profits for the day. Don't forget to include travel costs in there was well as some stall holders are traveling ridiculous distances just to attend your market. That profit is looking very slender right now isn't it? If it hasn't already disappeared , start calculating your cost of insurance and other legal balderdash pieces of paper that some stall holders need to have that can cost a mint.
2. Sneaky/unfair charges
- Oh, so you want $80 for a stall, +$10 more if you are casual and another $25 to get a corner position?
- Oh, you run a boutique market once a year/quarter and you think $300 is fair for a single table in whatever weather with no shade, not allowed to bring marquee but it is in a super trendy suburb?
- Oh, so sorry, we need you to have a WHITE marquee to fit into our market aesthetic. If you have the any other colour, we can rent you a suitable white marquee at additional cost to your stall fee.
Again, how much do you think stall holders are earning? Also, now considering that there are markets on every weekend all over Sydney that are probably CHEAPER! As a stall holder we are expected to have competitive prices yet organisers are charging like wounded bulls and then sneakily adding financial demands/add ons as they see fit.
3. Poor advertising/no advertising
If you have a food, wine and handcraft market - PROMOTE IT AS SUCH! Just plugging as a food and wine market and leaving off the handcrafts is unfair to those who have poured their heart and soul into creating beautiful crafts to sell at your market and have paid money for a stall. If they have paid for a stall, they are paying for a share of the advertising. Don't scratch your head and wonder why craft sellers are leaving your market in droves when the food aisles are full and the craft aisles are hearing crickets and watching tumbleweeds. How and where you advertise the market can significantly influence the quality and quantity of the patronage.
Even better was the organiser who only placed banners along a few major roads one or two days prior, charged a fortune per stall, claimed to be a fine hand craft market with ONLY handmade goods to find out that they were allowing in cheap poor quality imports and using what should have gone to advertising as his sole source of income instead of having a stall of his own, a regular day job or at least some other kind of income other than milking the stall holders. The website claimed to have over 200 stalls selling ONLY hand made goods...not in reality! It has less than 40 stall and as for solely handmade goods, that was highly debatable.
4. Too many of the one type of product/saturation
The wise market organiser will only have ONE of any type of seller out of respect for the sellers and the customers. The money blinded organiser will have 2,3 or even 4 of the same type of product which creates friction between sellers to start with. A glut of the same product and market goers will wonder why there are so many of the same product.
"Market must not be doing so well if they have to have double ups on stalls..."
"Such a small market and they have three cup cake sellers, two jam sellers AND 3 candle makers..."
The above are actual comments I have overheard market goes say to their friends, family or spouses.
Small markets do not need 3 jam sellers, 3 cup cake sellers, 3 soap sellers, 3 fudge sellers, 3 candle makers etc.... If you say you have stall holders waiting, then pick your stall holders wisely and stop doubling, tripling or more up on the same/similar product. Competition can be healthy but saturation is not. A saturated market will cause the profit made from 1-2 stall holders to be spread out between the many. This in turn can (and will) take money away from stall holders who may really need it (see above regarding income sources). If you reduce the profit made by a stall holder by introducing 1-2 more of the same type of product, that stall holder is MOST cases will start looking for another market that could return them to a profit rather than a barely break even or a loss. We sell our wares to make a profit, not to make a loss because, you, as a market organiser, have permitted an excessive amount of the same type of product into the event because of your love of the dollar.
BUT, many of us who have stalls are wondering how to justify some the stall fees that are being demanded. Prices are anywhere from $40 per stall and then head north on a very steep curve with some being $400 for a small one off charity market and some of those demanding a percentage of your takings on top of the fee. One event spotted recently was charging $1000+ per day for a 3 day event for a space in the middle of a paddock and your stall had to be operating from 11am to 11.30pm. Long damn day for no guarantee of any kind of sales that will come close to covering the stall fee.
One market I have attended advised told stall holders that if you are not making the stall fee back and with plenty of profit, you must have an inferior product and are not welcome back. Really? WTF? I must say, nice attitude to have about the people who are paying YOU to do the right thing and promote the market, not just promote your own produce and bugger the rest! Also the swipe about sitting down at your stall was unfair too. If I want or need to sit down at my stall, I shall!
Markets for some are their ONLY source of income or a significant proportion to a SUPPORTING income. Just this weekend the Father of a friend told me that people who sell at markets make a LOT of money. REALLY?? Did I set him straight very quickly! Some of us are barely walking away with $10 after paying stall fees and we haven't even factored in cost of the product to make stall fee, travel etc...
Please find below some points that my fellow stallholders and I have discussed many times over that may be of useful service when you are organising your next event:
1. Cost per stall vs amount of stock to cover stall fee then cover making of stock
Whilst this may or may not be obvious, not everyone who is a stall holder sells cheap items and on the flip side, not everyone sells high price items. Also not everyone sells produce that are required on a weekly basis. How much we have to sell to cover stall fee is one part of the equation, we then need to sell x amount on top of that just to cover the cost of the materials that went into paying for the stall fee. It usually works out around double. Eg. a $60 stall fee needs to have $120 in sales to break even and then stall holders need to pay for stalls in advance, so make it $180 before you even think of packing up and going home dreaming of your profits for the day. Don't forget to include travel costs in there was well as some stall holders are traveling ridiculous distances just to attend your market. That profit is looking very slender right now isn't it? If it hasn't already disappeared , start calculating your cost of insurance and other legal balderdash pieces of paper that some stall holders need to have that can cost a mint.
2. Sneaky/unfair charges
- Oh, so you want $80 for a stall, +$10 more if you are casual and another $25 to get a corner position?
- Oh, you run a boutique market once a year/quarter and you think $300 is fair for a single table in whatever weather with no shade, not allowed to bring marquee but it is in a super trendy suburb?
- Oh, so sorry, we need you to have a WHITE marquee to fit into our market aesthetic. If you have the any other colour, we can rent you a suitable white marquee at additional cost to your stall fee.
Again, how much do you think stall holders are earning? Also, now considering that there are markets on every weekend all over Sydney that are probably CHEAPER! As a stall holder we are expected to have competitive prices yet organisers are charging like wounded bulls and then sneakily adding financial demands/add ons as they see fit.
3. Poor advertising/no advertising
If you have a food, wine and handcraft market - PROMOTE IT AS SUCH! Just plugging as a food and wine market and leaving off the handcrafts is unfair to those who have poured their heart and soul into creating beautiful crafts to sell at your market and have paid money for a stall. If they have paid for a stall, they are paying for a share of the advertising. Don't scratch your head and wonder why craft sellers are leaving your market in droves when the food aisles are full and the craft aisles are hearing crickets and watching tumbleweeds. How and where you advertise the market can significantly influence the quality and quantity of the patronage.
Even better was the organiser who only placed banners along a few major roads one or two days prior, charged a fortune per stall, claimed to be a fine hand craft market with ONLY handmade goods to find out that they were allowing in cheap poor quality imports and using what should have gone to advertising as his sole source of income instead of having a stall of his own, a regular day job or at least some other kind of income other than milking the stall holders. The website claimed to have over 200 stalls selling ONLY hand made goods...not in reality! It has less than 40 stall and as for solely handmade goods, that was highly debatable.
4. Too many of the one type of product/saturation
The wise market organiser will only have ONE of any type of seller out of respect for the sellers and the customers. The money blinded organiser will have 2,3 or even 4 of the same type of product which creates friction between sellers to start with. A glut of the same product and market goers will wonder why there are so many of the same product.
"Market must not be doing so well if they have to have double ups on stalls..."
"Such a small market and they have three cup cake sellers, two jam sellers AND 3 candle makers..."
The above are actual comments I have overheard market goes say to their friends, family or spouses.
Small markets do not need 3 jam sellers, 3 cup cake sellers, 3 soap sellers, 3 fudge sellers, 3 candle makers etc.... If you say you have stall holders waiting, then pick your stall holders wisely and stop doubling, tripling or more up on the same/similar product. Competition can be healthy but saturation is not. A saturated market will cause the profit made from 1-2 stall holders to be spread out between the many. This in turn can (and will) take money away from stall holders who may really need it (see above regarding income sources). If you reduce the profit made by a stall holder by introducing 1-2 more of the same type of product, that stall holder is MOST cases will start looking for another market that could return them to a profit rather than a barely break even or a loss. We sell our wares to make a profit, not to make a loss because, you, as a market organiser, have permitted an excessive amount of the same type of product into the event because of your love of the dollar.
5. Quality of stallholders
Please, please, please, stop mixing quality produce with those who wish to clear out their garage! So many times recently I have seen good quality, handmade goods being lumbered together with someone who has swept the contents of their garage into a bin and dumped it out onto a tarpaulin. If you want to attract good quality patrons, then offer good quality stalls. If you want to attract junkers looking for anything and everything cheap, then keep the dust bins Barrys. People looking for good quality produce will be put off by junkers and junkers will not pay the extra for the better quality. Think about the kind of people you wish to attract as patrons, then work out your type of sellers/stall holders from there.
6. Poor market location
A back lot car park with poor access, even poorer parking for customers and on one hell of an angle is not a good start. Neither is a market located out in the middle of nowhere with poor signage, an entrance fee to patrons and poor quality of stall holders. Please think of the potential ground conditions in bad weather - be it raining or stinking hot. Hot days on black bitumen is a nightmare along with being on grass/dirt when it is bucketing rain.
Also, hiding a market in the quadrangle of a school that no one can see from the road and also along a very quiet road isn't going to entice the random person to stop and come in. The market needs to be visible from a roadway so that the 'passer by" will recognise that something is happening and will stop in and potentially spend money. If all you have are a few signs or banners but no sign of a market, people will think that the banners have just been left there and forgotten to be collected. Humans, being humans like to have a sticky beak and see what is happening for the sake of satisfying curiosity. A sign, most of the time, will not do that alone. They need to see the stalls and the bustle of the market.
7. Bad layout of market
Having your market spread out like a mad ivy vine is poor form along with changing the location of regular stall holders from market to market. If you want patrons to find all your stall holders, keep the layout in simple aisles, not spread out like a crazy maze that no one can get their way around.
Patrons who are returning to the market for a particular stall often go back to the same location to look for them. Don't go changing the stall locations around unless absolutely necessary, this is not Coles or Woolworths! Also, separating food from handcrafts can be detrimental in some markets. Some patrons ONLY go for handcrafts, others ONLY go for food, if you can mix up some of the food stalls with the handcraft stalls, people may walk around everything and not by pass others. I will agree that any food that needs to be cooked on site, should be kept together for the sake of not interfering with products that may be of fabric or of a scented nature.
8. Too many rules/always changing rules
A market that I once attended was forever changing their rules. There was an email sent out at least every week with nagging on current rules and changes of or adding to of those rules. This is not a new market by any means, it has been running for some years in various incarnations. Seriously, why make it harder and harder on the stall holders. The list of rules went from around 10 to now around 20+ and many are quite petty. This is a market, not the military.
6. Poor market location
A back lot car park with poor access, even poorer parking for customers and on one hell of an angle is not a good start. Neither is a market located out in the middle of nowhere with poor signage, an entrance fee to patrons and poor quality of stall holders. Please think of the potential ground conditions in bad weather - be it raining or stinking hot. Hot days on black bitumen is a nightmare along with being on grass/dirt when it is bucketing rain.
Also, hiding a market in the quadrangle of a school that no one can see from the road and also along a very quiet road isn't going to entice the random person to stop and come in. The market needs to be visible from a roadway so that the 'passer by" will recognise that something is happening and will stop in and potentially spend money. If all you have are a few signs or banners but no sign of a market, people will think that the banners have just been left there and forgotten to be collected. Humans, being humans like to have a sticky beak and see what is happening for the sake of satisfying curiosity. A sign, most of the time, will not do that alone. They need to see the stalls and the bustle of the market.
7. Bad layout of market
Having your market spread out like a mad ivy vine is poor form along with changing the location of regular stall holders from market to market. If you want patrons to find all your stall holders, keep the layout in simple aisles, not spread out like a crazy maze that no one can get their way around.
Patrons who are returning to the market for a particular stall often go back to the same location to look for them. Don't go changing the stall locations around unless absolutely necessary, this is not Coles or Woolworths! Also, separating food from handcrafts can be detrimental in some markets. Some patrons ONLY go for handcrafts, others ONLY go for food, if you can mix up some of the food stalls with the handcraft stalls, people may walk around everything and not by pass others. I will agree that any food that needs to be cooked on site, should be kept together for the sake of not interfering with products that may be of fabric or of a scented nature.
8. Too many rules/always changing rules
A market that I once attended was forever changing their rules. There was an email sent out at least every week with nagging on current rules and changes of or adding to of those rules. This is not a new market by any means, it has been running for some years in various incarnations. Seriously, why make it harder and harder on the stall holders. The list of rules went from around 10 to now around 20+ and many are quite petty. This is a market, not the military.
9. Lying organisers
Just recently I spoke with an organiser with a market very near me. She told me that they had no sellers of my kind at the market, at all. I put in my application, paid my fee and when I turned up on the day, lo and behold, another seller of the same type of product who sold bigger and cheaper than I. Whilst I understand that competition MAY be healthy in the right place and time, a small market of sub 15 stalls can't take duplicates and triplicates. If I had known there was another seller of the same produce, I would never have applied and to be told today that I am being pushed back to following week because they have two MORE sellers of the same product for this weeks' market... It makes me want to pack this all in and call it a day before I really have had a chance to start. Don't lie to your stall holders, you as just going to piss them off and they won't return. I won't be returning to this market after the lying and poor communication from the organisers.
10. Loyal stall holders vs disloyal organisers
You want the same stall holders to be loyal to your market yet when you shit on them and their product, don't advertise the market, charge a fortune in stall fees, have multiples of the same, you see where I am going here? See everything above. You want loyal stall holders, then be a loyal market organiser. Stop lining your own pockets with our money. Not everyone has an inferior product, it maybe a product that is not required on a regular basis. Keep the rules and nagging to a minimum (we have enough of that with customers/patrons). Stop putting multiples of the same type of stall in which eats into any potential profit. Respect us and we will respect you. Shit on us and we will find another market.
In conclusion, yes, as a stall holder, I understand that running a market is a pain in the rear and that some stall holders are an even bigger pain in the rear, but some of us try damn hard not to be. I have been close enough to several market organisers to know what they go through. I was once in charge of bump in for a market and know the drama that I and my fiance went through every market was like trying to herd cats at 6.30am on a Sunday morning every month. It was near impossible but MOST (not all) of the stall holders understood and knew that what we were doing was for them to get in and set up as quickly as possible. Running a market is not cheap, it is not easy and I for one appreciate the hard work and effort that you go through to get a market underway, but, do not take your stallholders for granted. There are so many markets here in Sydney every weekend and it is easy enough to make contact and find ourselves another venue and a more loyal and/or organised organiser.
Sincerely
Frustrated stall holders
10. Loyal stall holders vs disloyal organisers
You want the same stall holders to be loyal to your market yet when you shit on them and their product, don't advertise the market, charge a fortune in stall fees, have multiples of the same, you see where I am going here? See everything above. You want loyal stall holders, then be a loyal market organiser. Stop lining your own pockets with our money. Not everyone has an inferior product, it maybe a product that is not required on a regular basis. Keep the rules and nagging to a minimum (we have enough of that with customers/patrons). Stop putting multiples of the same type of stall in which eats into any potential profit. Respect us and we will respect you. Shit on us and we will find another market.
In conclusion, yes, as a stall holder, I understand that running a market is a pain in the rear and that some stall holders are an even bigger pain in the rear, but some of us try damn hard not to be. I have been close enough to several market organisers to know what they go through. I was once in charge of bump in for a market and know the drama that I and my fiance went through every market was like trying to herd cats at 6.30am on a Sunday morning every month. It was near impossible but MOST (not all) of the stall holders understood and knew that what we were doing was for them to get in and set up as quickly as possible. Running a market is not cheap, it is not easy and I for one appreciate the hard work and effort that you go through to get a market underway, but, do not take your stallholders for granted. There are so many markets here in Sydney every weekend and it is easy enough to make contact and find ourselves another venue and a more loyal and/or organised organiser.
Sincerely
Frustrated stall holders
